Sending mail from your servers

[tsunami]

Hi, we are thinking about your professional reseller hosting plan.

1. We are interested in using 'Joomla/Mambo' in your servers, but reading your 'AUP' we have found this point:

"10. Mass-mailing lists
No account hosted on Rochen Limited servers may send in excess of one-hundred (100) emails per ten (10) minutes or one thousand (1000) emails per twenty-four (24) hours. Any account found in violation of this policy will be immediately suspended."

We need clarification on this.
It's very possible we have some customers with 20.000 to 50.000 users.

If our customer wants to send a mass-mail using Joomla every day, week or month to their users, does makes the "Point 10 of the AUP" this impossible?.

We are not spammers, nor our customers, but it's very important to us to know if the hosting we choose let our customers 'speak' from their domains to theirs users.

2. What we need to get 'https' support in our hosting domains?
i.e. We want the register process of a new user in 'Joomla/Mambo' to be secure.
We want a domain for each customer: web1, web2, web3
We want each domain could use their own https://www.web1.com, https://www.web2.com and https://www.web3.com
Do we need one certificate for each domain?.
How much they cost?


Waiting for your answer. Thanks.

 

[acsurf]

You get a ssl cert with your reseller package and use it by going to

https://servername.rochen.com/~username/

 

[tsunami]

Yes, but we want each customer could use their own https domain to register and log-in to their site without the words 'rochen.com' appears.

We need something like https://www.web1.com

Do you know how to make this possible?

 

[Brad]

Welcoem to our forums. Hopefully we can answer a few of your questions.

1. The email sending limit is enforced on our shared servers. However if your site grows to large size, a dedicated server will allow you to control how much mail you send out yourself. That being said, there are ways to send out mail by limiting how many emails are sent each min/hr/day etc etc so as to keep within the AUP guidelines.

2. https://www.yourdomain.com is possible. However you will need a dedicated IP address (an add-on service we provide) as well as an SSL certificate (you can purchase a good one for around $25-$50).

If you have any more questions, feel free to ask.

 

[tsunami]

1. The email sending limit is enforced on our shared servers. ... That being said, there are ways to send out mail by limiting how many emails are sent each min/hr/day etc etc so as to keep within the AUP guidelines.

Please, tell me more about how limiting the emails.

 

[Chris]

Many mailing list applications, such as DaDa Mail (formerly called Mojo Mail), have a batch sending option. This means that if you had a mailing with 250 recipients, you could send it out in batches of 15 messages at a time instead of sending all 250 at once. This would allow you to stay within the limits set out in the Acceptable Use Policy (AUP).

Clearly, if you are sending a large volume of email (which we would consider 10,000 – 20,000 messages to be) then a Managed Dedicated Server would be the best route to go. Please feel free to contact me directly at: [email protected] and I would be happy to provide you with a price list for our Managed Dedicated Server offerings.

What you posted above about the SSL certificates is correct. Each domain setup with its own SSL certificate will require a dedicated IP address.

Please let us know if you have any further questions

 

[tsunami]

2. https://www.yourdomain.com is possible. However you will need a dedicated IP address (an add-on service we provide) as well as an SSL certificate (you can purchase a good one for around $25-$50).

Well, I understand that I need one dedicated IP address and also and SSL certificate for 'every' domain I want has their own https.

i.e. If i need three different domains, one for each of my three customers, i need three dedicated IP addresses and three different SSL certificates.

It's correct?.

 

[Chris]

That is correct. This is the same with any web hosting provider.

 

[tsunami]

"10. Mass-mailing lists
No account hosted on Rochen Limited servers may send in excess of one-hundred (100) emails per ten (10) minutes or one thousand (1000) emails per twenty-four (24) hours. Any account found in violation of this policy will be immediately suspended."

OK. Let's go again to the maximun of 1000 emails per 24 hours.

Our main interest is to use Joomla/Mambo with a forum and some another modules.

Every forum we could use in your hosting service has the the capability to susbcribe to all the answers of the full forum, something very common for a user.

Let's say we have only 1000 users, and in one day 10 new theads are created.
Each thread has 10 answers.

We have 1000 users x 10 answers = 10.000 e-mails sent to the users in only 24 hours.

Are you telling me we can't use your hosting to something so easy and so little as this?.

We need to contract a full Managed Dedicated Server from 400$/month?.

We like the other customers are saying about your services, but this point about the e-mails appears to us as a big hole in your offer.

Please, tell me if I'm wrong with any of my suppositions, but if I'm correct it means it's impossible to use any forum, mail-list, CMS with a few users (only 1000) subscribed to all the answers, in your hosting service without the use of a full Managed Dedicated Server of 400$/month.

We are really interested in the Premium Reseller Hosting account, but if only one domain with 1000 users has this limitation and 'eats' all my emails in a few hours, I see the only application for the Multiple Domain Account or the Premium Reseller account is to use mainly static sites, or sites who send only a few mails, limiting strongly the use of forums, mail-list and CMS like Joomla/Mambo and the others you are offering in your Fantastico addon.

P.S. If another customer is reading this, please tell me if you have any solution to my needs. Do you have my same problem and have found a solution?. Thanks.

 

[Chris]

What you say about the messages is correct. Please bear in mind though that we only actively police this policy if we see that you are causing system resource problems. We aren’t just going to shut you down once you hit 1,001 emails per 24 hours.

I think it is also worthwhile pointing out that I have never seen the type of situation you describe. Rochen host the official Joomla forums and website and although they are hosted on a Managed Dedicated Server with us, we still don’t see a huge volume of email traffic.

I have also never seen any website hosted on one of our shared servers pushing 10,000 messages within a 24 hour period.

 

[tsunami]

I'm triying hardly to undestand this point.
From your 'AUP' again:

"10. Mass-mailing lists
No account hosted on Rochen Limited servers may send in excess of one-hundred (100) emails per ten (10) minutes or one thousand (1000) emails per twenty-four (24) hours. Any account found in violation of this policy will be immediately suspended."

Well, I remember again our interest in the reseller option.

Please, define 'account'. It's a single e-mail account, a full reseller account...?

If we have 20 customer, i.e. 20 websites/domains, and one single customer use 1000 emails in the same day, will be applicated this point of the 'AUP' to the full reseller account?.

Or each email account could send till 1000 email/24h??.

I'm understand your previous answers but I'm really triying to have the maximum information on this point.

Maybe I give too much importance to this point but we really need our customers could send info to their users.

Thanks for your patience.

 

[tsunami]

Hi. There something there?.

 

[Chris]

This applies to each cPanel account, not the entire reseller account or each individual email account.

 

[timmcallister]

Hey folks

guess i want to chime in on the "1,000 emails in 24 hrs" topic.

I have a site with about 600-700 email subscribers, and expect it to continue to grow. I send out mailings about once a month.

The 100 messages in 10 minutes isn't a problem, cause the email tool i use spits them out a little slower than that, but I'd sure hate to have to move to a different hosting company cause I had 1,100 people on my mail list.

And i just don't want the hassles of scheduling these over multiple days. And I can certainly forsee on occassion wanting to send a last minute message out "today" for an event "tonight".


BTW - i am looking to sign up for the reseller account, not because i resell, but I run 4 or 5 sites for small business around town, and I have 4 or 5 vanity site. None of these use many resources, but no sense in paying $5/month for an additional domain

 

[Brad]

Why not setup your own smtp server to send out mail?

And as Chris said:

Please bear in mind though that we only actively police this policy if we see that you are causing system resource problems. We aren’t just going to shut you down once you hit 1,001 emails per 24 hours.

 

[miamiman]

Was there ever a final agreement on this issue? We too are thinking about moving to Rochen,

We have about a half-dozen domain sights - all rather smallish - that all incorporate some kind of newsletter function. Those subscriber lists run between 5,000 - 10,000. We do two mailings/month to those six lists for a total of approximately 100,000 emails per month.

I am trying to understand how the AUP applies to our case, and what the final solution is?

- Is the limit then 1,000 emails/domain/24 hours?
- If there is leeway in the above, how much [##/domain/24 hours]?
- A SMTP server? If so, how/where? At Rochen? How much?
- A dedicated server at $400/month?

Thanks,

 

[Chris]

Our position on this has been the same for a long time now

1. Yes, that is correct. There are also a couple of other limitations though if you read the full section on mailing.

2. There isn't any leeway here I am afraid.

3. We don't offer this service but you may wish to look at: http://www.authsmtp.com

4. Yes, although we will be introducing a Managed Virtual Server plan at $149.95 per month + $49.95 setup fee next month. These will not have mailing limits (like a full server) and will simply be capped by the physical resource limits available.

 

[miamiman]

Thank you...

1. I am still hazy about the "leeway". In the above thread you do mention that if a domain serves up 1,001 mails/domain/24 hour period, you will NOT shut down the account. So there is some kind of leeway I suppose. Please clarify.

In general however, the best + most cost effective solution would be a multiple or resellers hosting plan with an outside STMP server such as the one you pointed out?

Sorry for the insistence, but migrating from one service provider to another is always a pain. I'd rather be safe than sorry.

 

[bjf123]

I don't want to speak for Chris, but I think what he's saying is that they don't actively count every e-mail sent from every account every day, and when you hit 1,001 you get shut down. If the resources on the shared server start getting impacted, they'll look more closely and if your sending out 1,200 e-mails contributed to the server stress, your account would be suspended.

They do this to maintain the stability of their shared servers. If you really need to be sending out thousands of messages every day, you really need your own server. I certainly don't want my sites that happen to be on the same server as yours impacted because your e-mail needs are gobbling up resources.

 

[Christiaan]

I certainly don't want my sites that happen to be on the same server as yours impacted because your e-mail needs are gobbling up resources.

And that is why I am using Rochen, fast and reliable.